It is also the creation of Night Owl Optics, a sister company of Fisher and Teknetics, who are metal detector manufacturers…the metal detector manufacturer connection, and the sheer coolness of night vision is more than enough reason for me to write up a review on the iGen 20/20!

Who hasn’t dreamed of being able to see in the dark?  It ranks right up there with breathing underwater and flying with a jetpack!  The incredibly cool iGen 20/20 does indeed let you peer clearly into the darkness…not only that, but you can take photos of your nocturnal adventures as well!

Most of my readers may not realize I spent nearly 20 years in law enforcement prior to my current career. Being the resident PC nerd and gadget junkie, I was always involved in new technology grants and purchases. Years ago, I spent time learning how to operate a “Generation 1″ night vision scope. The thing felt like it weighed 30 pounds and had a big, bright green, CRT (Cathode Ray Tube) that you had to peer into. Battery life was abysmal and I spent hours doing “double takes” trying to figure out if you could really see anything with it that you couldn’t see without it!  Man, oh man…has technology improved!  Let’s check out the iGen 20/20!

First of all, it’s a nice stealthy black…and has a nice rubberized texture that helps ya keep your grip.  The iGen feels very rugged and professional.  The lens and manual focus system seems to be using high quality components.

On top, you’ll find 2 oval shaped buttons:  the first button (closest to the eye piece) has several functions.  first press powers the unit on…subsequent presses will activate the IR (infrared) LED spotlight (the smaller thing you see beside the larger lens).  Depressing the first button for around 3 seconds powers off the iGen.

There are 3 settings for the infrared lamp:

• Auto: (The iGen will actually measure available light, and throttle illumination power!)
• Full: The iGen 20/20 IR LED is cranked to the max…and it is powerful!
• Low: Bottom LED power setting, and offers the maximum power savings.

I have found that “auto” does an outstanding job of adjusting to my needs…whether I’m stalking a possum around the yard in inky blackness, or looking under my bed in the daytime trying to find my lost pair of shoes.  The iGen allows daytime usage by ingeniously including a lens cap with a small hole…this limits the light input and keeps the circuitry from over exposing the image.

As with all powerful Infrared LED lights, there can be a “tell-tale” red glow (faint, but visible) to the human eye.  Luckily, the iGen has a passive mode which allows you to disable the IR LED and  be totally “stealthy”!   The exposure control in the iGen will still allow you to “see” amazingly well using only available light from the moon or stars.  I spent quite a bit of time using only available light…I was ASTOUNDED with how clearly I could see cows in a neighboring field in (to the naked eye) total darkness!  Controlling the exposure with a small thumb wheel “switch” just below the eyepiece is easy to do on the fly…allowing you to tweak the iGen for conditions.

iGen Lens Cap with small hole for daytime use

The second button, when held for 3 seconds, activates the internal camera!  Taking photos in total darkness is pretty amazing!  I had a little fun capturing some pics of my domesticated critters while the lights were out…. (this is using the built-in IR lamp).  The included memory card holds a lot of photos, and plugs right into my multimedia reader on my PC for copying.

Binkie, the long-haired Chihuahua! captured in total darkness with the iGen

"Squeekie" the cat...my night vision is better than his!

Photos are in black and white, which is just as well since color only happens when you have “light”.

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There are a ton of adjustments available on the iGen.  Most are accessed via a three-way thumb switch below the eyepiece.

Here are some of the options available:

• IR on or off on startup (useful for super-stealthiness!)
• Gain- 10 different “gain” settings…this is the light amplification adjustment.
• Color – the iGen allows you to view the image as:  White, Green, Blue and Red.  White and Green seemed to suit me the best for discerning details.
• Brightness- 4 settings…how bright the view is in the eyepiece
• Exposure- Think about this in terms of shutter speed…you can manually control this so that you can see amazingly well in EXTREMELY low light conditions!  The refresh speed will slow down in the eyepiece, but Wow!  If you’re using slow exposure to take photos, it’s probably a good idea to use the tripod mount that is on the belly of the iGen to help stabilize things.
• Video Format- When you’re recording using the built-in video jack, you can choose whether to output as NTSC (U.S. standard) or PAL (European standard)
• Date and Time- This allows photos to be date/time stamped when it’s set.  Another cool feature…you have 15 minutes to replace the batteries before you lose your date and time settings!

I gotta tell ya…I wish I had one of these when I was still in Law Enforcement!  The iGen is MILES  ahead of the multi-thousand dollar gear we used years ago…and at a fraction of the price!  The unique technology employed by First Texas in this device is absolutely astounding…I have had a blast playing with it!

iGen in included case

Here are some iGen advantages as listed in the owners manual:

• The World’s only night vision system with integrated photographic capability
• Better image quality with high, 30-line-pair per millimeter, edge-to-edge display resolution
• Better image quality with no image distortion from photocathode or phosphorescent screen blemishes
• Easier diopter focusing
• Two-times the sensitivity to infrared light, useful in total darkness with the aid of the infrared emitter
• Intelligent infrared emitter. Microprocessor automatically adjusts infrared intensity and electronic gain to optimize image to changing ambient light conditions
• Undistorted infrared emitter- bright clear scene illumination with no dark spots and no uneven light patterns
• Ambient light amplification higher than generation-1 technology at default exposure.  Light amplification capability superior to Generation-3 with the use of exposure control
• Easy-connect video capture capability through composite video output
• Programmability
• Bright-light see-through capability.  No bright-spot blooming or halo-effect typical with conventional night vision
• More robust. No risk of damage from bright light exposure.  No fragile vacuum tubes.

The iGen box

SPECIFICATIONS:
MODEL: NOIGM3X
MAGNIFICATION: 2.6x
ANGLE OF VIEW: 12 DEG
FIELD OF VIEW: 70′ AT 330′
RESOLUTION: EDGE TO EDGE 30 LP/MM
POWER SUPPLY: 4 AA Batteries
WEIGHT: 21OZ
DIMENSIONS: 9″ X 4″ X 2.5″

FEATURES:

* Ambient light amplification of 650 times
* Works day or night
* Variable Frame Rate – user adjustable exposure time to enhance light gathering capability. From 2 fps to 30 fps
* Infrared Intelligence – 3 modes. Wattage adjusts automatically as needed for varying levels of darkness
* Variable display brightness
* Enhanced infrared sensitivity, double that of intensifier tube technology
* Clarity across the screen – edge to edge
* Programmable time out features
* Color output choices
* Video composite output

http://www.igen2020.com/

Click the link below to request information via email

iGen info email

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Fisher F5 Field Test

Mark Ellington

Fisher F5 Face

I was given the wonderful opportunity to do some field testing with Fisher’s amazing new F5. The F5 is one of the most unique detectors I’ve put my hands on in a very long time! The perfect blend of cutting edge, software driven power meshed with the feel of good old fashioned knobs. I find it very interesting that the “oldest name in metal detecting” is utilizing the newest technology! The F5 is the result of Fisher’s self proclaimed “war on bad user interfaces”. The lead Engineer on the F5 was Jorge A. Saad.

Since Fisher Laboratories came under new management, the Company has not been resting on their laurels! First out of the gate came the incredible F75, followed by the mid-range F4. Next up was the affordable F2, then recently the incredibly deep F70. That leads us up to the innovative F5!

The F5 is situated in the familiar F2/F4 housing, but the electronics are entirely different. This platform was designed by Engineers Jorge Saad and Dave Johnson (with John Gardiner and Mark Krieger additionally lending their talents) to offer outstanding discrimination, depth and ID capabilities. You’ll find the F5 mounted on the familiar gold and black “S” rod which has proven its ergonomics and durability throughout the years.

*Click below to see the rest of the review*

FEATURES:

PHASE LOCK- This outstanding idea allows the user to quickly grab the current PHASE reading on the F5 LCD while metal detecting. A few quick “bobs” of the coil, and you’ll get a consistent PHASE which will lock with a 1 second depression of the button. The process is quick, easy and accurate. During normal hunting, the F5 is displaying the current “ground phase” or ground setting in the SETTING window. By viewing the live phase reading as you hunt, and comparing it to the “locked” phase, you’ll always know if you’re adjusted correctly for currently ground conditions!

TONES - The tones button allows the user to choose between 1 tone, 2 tones (Iron low tone, foil and above high tone), 3 tones and 4 tones. I also discovered while testing the F5 another cool “tones” feature. When hunting in “autotune” all-metal mode, the button will change the pitch of the audio to suit the users’ preference.

PINPOINT-The F5 uses a nice VCO style pinpoint which varies the audio pitch and volume based on the strength of the target signal. The ID window also switches over to an “inches” of depth reading.
FREQ. – Frequency allows you to slightly alter the F5’s transmit/receive frequency when facing interference from various sources including other detectors, power lines, etc.

NOTCH- Notching works great on the F5! On quite a few detectors, I’ve found myself fumbling through layers of menus trying to find the segment I wanted to discriminate out (or in). With the F5, each press of the NOTCH button advances a line that strikes through the target designation in the top ID arc. When you get to the target you want removed (foil, for example) you simply quit pressing the button. After a brief pause, the target is “notched out”. That simple! Notching a target “in” is just as easy. Rotate the DISC knob the desired amount (through ZINC for example), then advance the strike through line to the 5 cent icon. Release the NOTCH button and VOILA! The target (nickels in this case…) will now be detected.

F5 closeup

KNOBS:

My favorite aspect of the F5 has to be the brilliant use of knobs! They are strategically positioned for “thumbing” the controls that you use the most. I feel a user “connection” with the F5 that I haven’t felt with any other detector. With the fine tuning capabilities offered by the high resolution ground balance, gain, threshold and discrimination knobs, I always feel liked I have “tweaked” the F5 for its maximum potential at any given site.

GND BAL- Although the F5 has the option to “GRAB” the phase reading for quick and efficient ground balancing, it still provides an very high resolution manual balancing feature. Another interesting aspect of the manual ground balance is a speed proportional piece of software (written by Mark Krieger) that will “accelerate” the numbers much more quickly depending upon how fast you turn the knob. Turn it slowly for very exact settings, spin it fast for jumping quickly up or down the scale!

GAIN- The “GAIN” control is the front-end transmit power of the F5. It is also the ON/OFF control for the Detector.

THRESH- By making THRESHOLD an easily accessed control, you can fine tune and tweak all you want! There’s a synergetic relationship between the GAIN and THRESHOLD controls that has been made much, much more dynamic and accessible due to the knob controls being right there in front of you. The THRESHOLD control gave me the ability to hunt sites that normally were “huntable”, but offered a great deal of frustration. One of these is located in an area that is surrounded by an electric cattle fence. This particular spot has driven me crazy in the past with various detectors due to the “pulse” of electrical interference transmitted. The F5 was able to handle the spot incredibly by turning the THRESHOLD into the slight negative numbers. (-2 to -3 for this location).
If you’ve ever hunted places that are littered with tiny bits of metal (foil or rusty bits of tin roofs, for example) , then you know that it can be a challenge due to constant chatter on every swing. Quite often, these nuisances can be too small to dig and remove. The THRESHOLD control does a great job of “quieting” down sites like this by make the F5 less sensitive to smaller targets. I was initially concerned I would be losing a lot of depth by turning the threshold into the negative, but on coin sized conductors, I haven’t found a great deal of difference. Most of these sites are already limited due to these small surface targets creating a shield that masks the deeper goodies.

DISCRIM- By giving the F5 a knob dedicated to DISCRIMINATION, the user can easily change settings “on-the-fly” with instantaneous feedback from the detector as to where you have it set. The F5 operator has three methods to visually verify where they are situated in regard to discrimination.
1. Target Identification Arc- The F5 offers a very nice visual quick reference along the top of the LCD screen. A clock-wise rotation will advance lines that strike out each target group you desire.
2. Setting window- When any changes are being performed, the SETTING windows reflects that change in detail. When using DISCRIM, a fine tuning number as to the amount of discrimination dialed into the knob is shown. For example, if you want to eliminate the lower range of “FOIL”, yet keep the upper range, no problem! Discrimination resolution is down to the single digit of the “1” to “65” range scale.
3. Physical knob- Like with most analog detectors, the physical location of the knob indicator is scaled to the DISCRIM range. I may be starting my hunt and getting set up. I know from using the F5, the “M” in DISCRIM is approximately just below the 5¢ (nickel) designation. I nice little quick reference!
LCD Screen information: The F5 gives the user a wealth of valuable information that is always right there in front of you.
• Target ID arc- The F5 gives you a quick visual reference on detected targets along the top. Each of the 8 segments has a common target designation (Fe, FOIL, 5¢, TAB, ZINC, DIME, QTR and 50+) as well as the top of each segments conductivity range (15 for Fe, 25 for FOIL, etc.)
• STATUS- The left side on the F5 screen gives you the “status” of your batteries (2 nine volt “transistor” batteries) and the SETTINGS portion at the bottom keeps you informed on what changes you are making while adjusting knobs and buttons. For example, when I adjust “GAIN”, my adjustments are reflected in real-time here. The same goes for PHASE LOCK, GND BAL, TONES, THRESH, DISCRIM and FREQ! Whew! That’s a lot of useful information the F5 feeds the user!

• TARGET ID- in the center of the screen is a nice, large, 2 digit target identification. Visibility has been excellent, regardless of whether hunting in bright sunlight or in overcast conditions. Along the bottom of the screen is a CONFIDENCE bar. The F5 has processing software that evaluates the target on each swing, determining how “sure” the detector is that the target indeed matches the designation in the ID arc. For example, while hunting, I hear and see a buried target that’s identified as a “dime”. I will subsequently continue swinging ,shoulder width, over the target and watch the CONFIDENCE bar. If the ID remains steady, and the bar is full on most swings, there’s a much higher probability that it will indeed be a dime! Nothing is perfect, and really deep targets may not always consistently hit as high “confidence”. When in doubt, DIG! The TARGET ID also switches over to a DEPTH reading when the pinpoint button is depressed.

• GND DATA- On the right side of the screen, the F5 gives you great, “live” information about the site you are hunting! The Fe³O 4 graph informs you of the magnetic susceptibility of the ground you’re currently hunting. When the reading is high, accurate identification of deep targets can be altered a bit. In real life use, if you’re hunting a site that has the potential for deep, old coins and you notice the Fe meter is “high”, dig the questionable deep targets!
The real attention grabber here is the “phase” reading. One aspect I love about all the new Fisher detectors is the implementation of “useful” features…PHASE is basically a real-time, live ground reading. In my area, I can watch the phase change itself…varying several numbers as I wander about a typical field or old Church Yard. When I see a drastic change, a quick press of the PHASE LOCK button, and I’m accurately balanced for my spot! Pretty cool stuff!

F5 coil

Hunting with the F5:
As I mentioned earlier, I feel a connection when using the F5 I have not experienced with all my other detectors. The combination of real-time digital information and the tactile feedback of knobs work together beautifully while searching my favorite sites. Recently I was hunting an old school yard. This particular site, being located in the center of town, has been hunted for many years. Old coin finds are very rare these days, and are always deep. With the instant access to controls and information offered by the F5, I was up and hunting in seconds. The elliptical concentric coil seems to be the perfect size for getting great depth while still allowing for excellent target separation that the new F series Fishers are renowned for. Another great feature common in the F series of Fisher’s is also in the F5. That is incredible processor speed! The detector resets itself so quickly that good targets buried beside of rejected targets still sing out loud and clear. One of the first targets I retrieved on this old school yard hunt was a silver dime less than an inch away from an old rusty chunk of iron. The target ID of the F5 was dead on the “money” and the confidence bar was high for “dime” although it was retrieved at more than 6 inches.
In my North Carolina soil, it’s not uncommon for older copper coins to deteriorate quite a bit. This generally means to get Wheat Pennies and Indian Head Cents you need to dig targets that ID in the “ZINC” and “TAB” range. On this hunt, I got a nice soft high tone while searching the middle of the yard. The target pinpointed small (a GREAT sign!) and deep. After quite a bit of digging, I retrieved a nice 1919 Wheat Cent at a measured 8 inches…and it ID’ed in “DIME” range (genuine copper pennies and dimes both ID at this icon, but with different TID’s)…very uncommon occurrence for this soil! The penny was as corroded as most I dig, and it was deep for this soil. I have found the F5 to regularly surprise me with its depth and accurate identification.
I ended the hunt this day with an apron full of coins and a very, very satisfied feeling that the F5 is an EXCELLENT detector! There is no doubt in my mind that there has been a lot very careful design work to get it “just right!”. This is a detector that perfectly blends the world of analog knobs and digital circuitry in such a way that you always feel in total control…and have confidence that you have the settings just right for the conditions!

F5 autograph Jorge Saad

Authors note: I had such a BLAST testing the F5, I asked the lead Engineer Jorge Saad to autograph it for me…and he did! Thanks again Mr. Saad!

* 7.8 kHz frequency – good for coin shooting,
relic hunting, and casual gold prospecting.
* Frequency shift for eliminating electrical interference and crosstalk.
* Advanced software-based motion discrimination with notch for searching
trashy areas.
* All metal autotune mode for deep-searching
in non-trashy areas.
* Visual target ID by category & 0-99 indication, both discrimination & autotune modes.
* Target ID confidence bargraph.
* High-resolution manual ground balance with continuous ground readout.
* Ground balance range goes all the way to salt.
* Continuous display of ground mineral concentration and phase.
* Push-button static pinpoint with variable audio pitch and visual depth reading.
* Independent gain and threshold knobs provide complete control over sensitivity.
* Standard 10″ elliptical concentric open center searchcoil.
* Two 9-volt alkaline batteries last approximately 40 hours.

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Introduction:

First of all, I want to thank Tom Walsh, Mike Scott, Tricia Richardson, Dave Johnson and John Gardiner for their help in arranging this interview. I think it’s a fair statement that First Texas – Fisher is one of the most exciting metal detector companies on the planet right now, and as such, has piqued the interest of the hobby detecting world in a way that hasn’t been seen for quite a while.

I had the idea for this interview months ago, before I had started this web site. There was quite a buzz in the forums when rumors started of a new Dave Johnson design coming from First Texas under the Teknetics moniker. After the subsequent release and success of the T-2, the hobby community was set on fire with excitement over the prospects of “things to come”. Another wave of excitement hit when it was learned First Texas had acquired Fisher, and that wave turned into a tsunami with the release of the F-75. Mr. Johnson was quick to point out that the T-2 and F-75 were team efforts, not solo projects, and that Engineer John Gardiner was key to the success of both machines.

The purpose of this interview is to give the fans of metal detecting a “behind the scenes” glimpse of the engineers who designed the T-2, F-75 and F-4. There is an unusual “connection” people in this hobby have with their metal detectors. Over time, they seem to take on a personality of their own, becoming an extension of the owner/user. Because of this “personal” connection, most view the responsible engineers with a sense of awe and mystery. I feel that “getting to know” the Engineers will help people appreciate and applaud the outstanding efforts of these geniuses behind the scenes.

All questions below are for both Mr. Johnson and Mr. Gardiner, unless otherwise designated.

Question 1:

DS: What got you interested in engineering metal detectors?

Dave: “In the early 1970’s I was working for CALTRANS doing traffic census. Some of that work involved inductive loop vehicle detectors. I got tired of hauling a 150-pound box of lead-acid batteries around to power them, and prototyped a vehicle detector that ran off a single 9-volt “transistor battery”. It was too unstable to be useful, but to my surprise it discriminated between cars and trucks. Then I got transferred to another department and abandoned work on the vehicle detector.

In 1981 I was hired by Fisher Research Lab, which at that time was in Los Banos, California. I’ve been working in the metal detector industry ever since.”

John: “After I graduated from UTEP I landed a job with First Texas Manufacturing. I started working on the different model for Bounty Hunter line. ”

Question 2:

DS: How do you feel about the excitement amongst metal detecting hobbyists generated by the T-2 and the F-75?

Dave: “We intended for the T2 and F75 to be exciting products. We’re pleased that our effort was a success.

Not all metal detectors are supposed to be “exciting”. Many are revisions of established familiar products, and customers buy them because there’s a good track record behind them. Some products are new and different enough to generate a lot of interest, like our new F4. It’s getting a lot of attention because it’s a new combination of stuff that offers uncommonly good performance and features for the price. But it doesn’t generate the kind of excitement that major technological advances do.”

John: “I was very pleasantly surprised at how fast the T2 popularity has grown.”

Question 3:

DS: How difficult was it walking the line between superb ergonomics and weight vs. structural durability (on the T-2 and F-75)?

Dave: “It took a lot of attention to detail. I was originally shooting for even lower weight. I’ve been studying the physiology of metal detector ergonomics for my whole career and on this product I had a blank check to get it right. There were things we had to do to get the ergonomics right that added weight. We were all betting that good ergonomics was more important than shaving every ounce, and the T2 and F75 proved us right. Nobody is saying we should have made it lighter.”

John: “I really did not get to involved with this issue.”

Question 4:

DS: Do you guys metal detect as a hobby? If so, what’s your favorite “find” to date?

Also, what are your other hobbies?

Dave: “I don’t detect as a hobby, but enjoy field testing units with people who really know their stuff. I especially enjoy field testing gold machines because both my grandfathers were gold prospectors and I inherited from them some of that love for geology and the desert.

My main hobby if you can call it that, is being successful at treating the supposedly “untreatable” Lou Gehrig’s Disease (ALS), and helping other ALS patients do the same. If anyone reading this has ALS or knows someone who does, I invite them to contact me at scandalousdave@gmail.com and mention “ALS” in the subject line so I’ll know it isn’t spam.”

John: “I don’t detect as a hobby, but do have a unit that I use at home.

My other hobbies are bike riding and reading.”

Question 5:

DS: Would you mind giving us a list of detectors you’ve had a hand in developing?

Dave: “Old Fisher: 1260, 1220, 1210, 1225, 1235, 1265, 1266, 1280, Impulse, CZ6, CZ5, CZ20, Gold Bug, Gold Bug II, TW6/Gemini, FX-3, and several industrial products.

Tesoro: Diablo MicroMax, Lobo Supertraq.

White’s: DFX, Beachhunter ID, GMT, MXT

Troy: Shadow X5

Bounty Hunter & related products: nearly everything we manufacture. Many of these products are adapted from the original Teknetics which was designed by George Payne. The Teknetics T2 however was an entirely new design.

New Fisher: F75, F4, and everything else since then.

On most of the above I was the lead engineer. On the White’s DFX and Beachhunter ID I developed the multiple frequency circuitry, and other engineers designed products around that circuitry. In addition to the above there are many products on the market which are adaptations by other engineers of products I designed.”

John: “Bounty Hunter : I have had a hand in most of our current line up from the bottom to the top, from Guardian to the Time Ranger.

Teknetics : T2 I was main programmer

The Fisher’s : The F4 and F75″

Question 6:

DS: Are we about “maxed out” as far as how deep VLF units will go? In your opinion, what’s the biggest obstacle for current technology in achieving increased useable detection depth?

Dave: “Getting extra depth out of a VLF, multifrequency, or PI machine is very difficult, because these machines follow an inverse 6th power law relationship between signal voltage and depth. If everything else is maintained equal, doubling the depth requires 64 times as much signal. If this is done by increasing transmitter power, doubling depth requires 4,096 times as much battery drain. That’s the basic reason why depth increases come so slowly in this industry.

The biggest impediment to getting usable depth in the ground, is interference from magnetic and electrically conductive minerals in the ground, which can produce signals hundreds of times as strong as that of the metal target you’re trying to detect and hopefully identify. There are several approaches to extracting the metal signal from the ground mineral signal, but they all have their limitations. That’s why you see several different technologies coexisting in the market.”

John: “Dave points out biggest obstacle which is seeing target through the Ground and Air interference.”

Question 7:

DS: If you had to pick one existing feature on the F-75 that you’re the proudest of, what would it be?

Dave: “If we can include the T2, it’s a tossup between the ergonomics and the target separation. Both aspects of the design were huge leaps forward.

If you mean just the F75: the fact that on the F75 we pushed sensitivity even further than on the T2. As I said a few questions back, more sensitivity is very difficult to get in this industry.”

John: “One of things I like best about the F75 is it has the ability to give I.D. values while in static mode.”

Question 8:

DS: Are TID pulse units the hobby future? Or, what do you think will be the next great advancement in metal detector technology?

Dave: “About 1985 I built a real sweetheart of a discriminating PI unit, not very hot in air test, but it was simple, lightweight, powered by one 9 volt “transistor battery”, ran quiet in bad ground, had no bad habits, and you didn’t have to dig any trash. It morphed into a fully static TID machine which Fisher came close to releasing about 1989, but its reliance on fully static operation which was supposed to be an advantage, was in fact a fatal flaw for a TID machine. Stripped back down, it became the Impulse which was strictly all-metals.

Industry insiders know about a PI TID machine which a fairly sharp freelancer has had under development for about 5 years and which is said to be nearing production. Whether or not that one makes it, I expect there will eventually be others.

The next great advancement in metal detector technology will be….. ahem… we’ll all know when whatever it is actually hits the market and customers say it’s a great advancement. I hope that when that event happens, it’s got our trademark on it. If it’s got someone else’s trademark, I guess we’ll just have to play leapfrog.”

John: “At this point I will reserve comment.”

Question 9:

DS: “Crystal ball” time… if you had to take an educated guess, what do you think hobby detecting hardware will be looking like 10 years from now? (Operational and physical)

Dave: “Everything will look like a T2/F75 clone.

Just kidding! Actually, I do expect machines to show up on the market looking a lot like the T2/F75. But, there will always be a lot of variety in what machines look like and how they’re designed to be used. Some machines 10 years from now will probably look about the same as they do today. The Tesoro Micromax is such a good basic mechanical design that it or something similar will still be around 10 years from now.

Operation? The basic 2 or 3 knob VLF motion discriminator has been around for almost 25 years and does very well what it’s supposed to do. It’ll probably still be around 10 years from now. Predicting what the leading edge high end machines will be like 10 years from now is a lot more difficult because the path as yet untrod offers so many surprises.

To put this in perspective, 25 years ago I was predicting the impending demise of single-frequency metal detectors. 16 years ago Fisher introduced the CZ and Minelab introduced the Sovereign, both of ‘em multiple frequency machines. But single-frequency metal detectors kept getting better, and in 2007 the happiest F75 owners are the ones who already have a multiple frequency Minelab Explorer.”

John: “With advances in display technology and RF technologies. They should be lighter and even more ergonomic than the T2.”

Question 10:

DS: The “halo effect”… fact or fiction?

Dave: “Mostly fiction. A lot of what people attribute to “halo” actually has to do with what happens to the natural magnetic and conductive structure of the soil matrix when you disturb it.

The rust that remains from a rusting iron object is definitely a “halo” which can have a definite effect on detectability and on target ID.

Corrosion from nonferrous metals is essentially neutral to metal detectors and is present in too small an amount to affect detection. It is plausible that the electrochemical corrosion process of nonferrous metals influences the geochemistry of the iron minerals in the immediate vicinity of the target; however I doubt that such an effect would be sufficiently prominent as to influence detectability.

Nonetheless, there are a lot of beeperists whose actual field experience leads them to believe that the halo effect is real, independently of the question of whether the conventional explanation (“conductive corrosion products”) is right or wrong. I’ve been around the block enough times to have encountered things which seemed impossible and yet there they were. One of these days I may have to eat my words about “halo effect”.”

Question 11:

DS: “Detectable depth of a target cannot exceed the diameter of the coil” ie: 8” coil goes 8” deep. Agree or disagree?

Dave: “Not true. Most metal detectors will detect a manhole cover at least 2 feet deep, and most won’t detect a 1-grain gold nugget 1 inch deep. Small coils usually detect deeper than people expect them to, and large coils usually buy you sweep width rather than additional depth.”

John: “Disagree. We already have a unit that with a 4” coil can detect coin size objective at 6”.”

Question 12:

DS: What new, top-secret detectors are you currently working on? (HA! Just kiddin’)

Dave: “The Eta-Kappa. No kidding. So what’s an “Eta-Kappa”? Sorry, can’t tell you.”

John: “Ha Ha!”

Question 13:

DS: What’s the working environment like at First Texas?

Dave: “Love it. Flat organizational structure, there’s no engineering dept. manager, we all work for Tom. Tom is a very smart fellow, eager to innovate, very much in charge and yet doesn’t micromanage, flexible enough to change course when it’s necessary, listens better than just about any other boss on the planet, and doesn’t sweat the small stuff as long as things are getting done that need to be done.

Oh yeah, also the air conditioning in engineering dept. works real good during hot weather.

You didn’t ask how I like El Paso. Love it. Decent climate, desert mountains to hike in, friendly people, low crime rate, low cost of living, and great Mexican food.

We also have the nation’s stupidest ex-mayor. Joe tried to get through airport security packing a loaded pistol…….. His excuse? “But I have a concealed weapon permit.” Yeah, right, here’s your piece back, proceed to your boarding gate? I don’t think so!”

John: “It’s a good environment, we are always looking forward while learning from our past.”

Question 14:

DS: (For Dave Johnson) Can you tell us about how FRL came up with the innovative 1200 series design, which really set the bar for “balance” over the heavier “lunchboxes” of the 80’s?

“When I came to work for Fisher in February of ’81, Fisher was just about dead. They knew they needed new product. They didn’t have anyone in house who could design the guts, so they got to work on the mechanicals and hoped to hire someone who could design the guts. That someone turned out to be me. We introduced the 1260 in late spring of ’82, and it was a revolutionary machine for its time. Credit for the mechanicals goes to Dick Williams, Marvin Jones, Jim Lewellen, and Carol Chandler. They got a heckuvalotta stuff right.”

Question 15:

DS: Do you have a collection of different coins and trash items in your engineering department that you test target ID with? How about test beds/gardens with different soil types? Do you rely heavily on field testers for soil type handling information?

“The old Fisher site in California had a carefully designed and constructed test bed with several different sections where we imported different soil minerals so we could emulate almost any mineral condition besides alkali or salt water. It was an expensive undertaking which we haven’t replicated here in El Paso because we don’t own the premises.

In design, I rely heavily on my knowledge of soil mineral conditions around the country and how they affect metal detectors. We do limited field testing locally, but El Paso doesn’t have a wide variety of soil conditions. For design verification we rely on field testing by people in other regions who have in-depth experience with a number of metal detectors and who are articulate in explaining what happens during field testing.”

Question 16:

DS: Do you follow the online detecting forums and do you feel these help to promote your product and the hobby?

“There are several detecting forums that I take a look at almost every day. They’re good for the hobby, and they’re also a valuable source of information for us. I don’t post on the forums, because I don’t have time to get into nonsense arguments with people. Once in a while when we feel it would be beneficial for information to be posted on a forum, for instance to get a stupid rumor straightened out, we leak the information semi-officially to people who are already active on the forums and give them permission to post it if they feel like it.”

Question 17:

DS: (For John Gardiner) Mr. Gardiner, in the 70’s and early 80’s there was a detector company, “Gardiner Metal Detectors”, with huge rods and search coils… any relation?

John: “Not that I know of”

Question 18:

DS: There’s been a lot of emphasis on the DD coil design for the new Teknetics and Fisher machines. What was your main motivation for going DD versus concentric?

Dave: “Better ground penetration. And some other stuff. ‘Nuff said about that.”

Question 19:

DS: Iron separation seems vital nowadays & perhaps more important than depth. Can detectors truly “see thru the iron”, or is “unmasking” best achieved at this point with smaller or DD coils?

Dave: “Mostly yes on all counts.”

John “Nice one Dave.”

Question 20:

DS: Seems specialized detectorists feel frequency/khz is so important now, claiming a 7khz Coin$trike for example is for coins not relics. Is 13khz great for all-around hunting, & why don’t we see say 25khz units for relic hunters?

“In general, higher frequencies are better for smaller and lower conductivity stuff, and lower frequencies are better for larger and higher conductivity stuff. Relic hunters are generally looking for stuff that is smaller or lower conductivity than US clad, copper, and silver coinage. However, frequency is not critical, and a 7 kHz machine can be good on relics and a 13 kHz machine can be good on coins.

Metal detector manufacturers generally avoid the 20-30kHz range because of electrical interference from military communications.”

Question 21:

DS: There have already been two new models released for Fisher in the past 5 months, the F-75 and the F-4. Is this a sign of things to come?

Dave/John: “Yep.”

Question 22:

DS: Are there any tricks or tips for the F4, T-2 or F-75 you’d like for users to know about?

Dave: “The F4 is pretty straightforward. Only tip is to use autotune all metals if you’re in an area that’s relatively free of trash to locate targets, and then switch to discrimination to ID them. You’ll get more deeper stuff that way.

The T2 and F75 are very sensitive machines, which makes them more vulnerable to electrical interference than a less aggressive machine like the F4. And, the T2 and F75 incorporate a number of improvements in discriminator design, some of which affect sensitivity independently of the sensitivity control setting. This caused more confusion than we expected. Fortunately most owners are getting used to it.

My personal recommendation is to select the discrimination process you want, then dial in the discrimination level you want, then set any notches you want, and then after doing all that set the sensitivity setting just below the edge of noise. Don’t be afraid to crank the sensitivity ‘way down if necessary: the T2 and F75 are still hot machines even at low sensitivity settings.”

John: “Slow down and listen to what the machine is telling you.”

Question 23:

DS: There are lots of forum rumors floating around in regards to the possible return of a Fisher water detector…. Any comment?

Dave: “Marketing dept. has released information indicating that a water machine called a “CZ-21” is in the works.”

Question 24:

DS: What’s the most challenging part of designing metal detectors for the hobby market?

Dave: “Psychology.”

Closing:

DS: Do you have any parting words for all the www.detectorstuff.com readers and metal detecting fans at large that are following your work?

“We’re building on a legacy that was created by many people. The progress we make is the work of many people. Of these many people, most never get any credit other than a paycheck and maybe a thank-you.

I would like to name two of those unsung heroes. Javier, who assembles prototype boards faster than anyone else on the planet and somehow does that while making no assembly errors. Aurora, who worked hard to make sure every T2 went out right, even while she was losing her fight with cancer.

First Texas Products is still benefiting from the genius of George Payne, whose basic target ID system has gone into more metal detectors sold, than all other target ID systems put together. Thanks, George.

Finally, I would like to thank my former employers for the privilege of having worked for them.”

DS: Thanks again for taking the time to answer these questions! I have no doubt folks will thoroughly enjoy reading your responses. In closing, if there’s a question, that as you read this you thought “Now why didn’t they ask *blank*?” please feel free to add it and I’ll make sure it’s included on the site!

“What are your favorite designs?”

Dave: “This will probably surprise you. My all-time favorite designs are the Tesoro Diablo Micromax, and the little Bounty Hunter two-knobber that goes by several different names and retails in the $55-75 range.”

John: “My favorite unit so far is the Land Ranger. The T2 come in at a close second.”

DetectorStuff: We hope our readers have enjoyed this interview as much as we have! I want to personally thank the great folks at First Texas /Fisher for allowing us to interview Dave and John. These two gentlemen are extremely busy, and taking the time out of their hectic schedules for this is hugely appreciated! Special thanks also goes out to Bill Ladd who thought up quite a few of the great questions for the interview.

Thanks again,

Mark Ellington & Bill Ladd

www.detectorstuff.com

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